Jobvite

4,1 (562)
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Software de reclutamiento

Calificación general

4,1 /5
(562)
Relación calidad-precio
4,0/5
Funciones
3,9/5
Facilidad de uso
4,1/5
Asistencia al cliente
4,0/5

79%
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Opiniones de 562

Josh
Josh
Calificación general
  • Sector: Telecomunicaciones
  • Tamaño de la empresa: 1.001-5.000 empleados
  • Software usado A diario durante Más de dos años
  • Fuente de la reseña

Calificación general

  • Relación calidad-precio
  • Facilidad de uso
  • Asistencia al cliente
  • Probabilidad de recomendación 9.0 /10

Jobvite Review

Revisado el 19-10-2018

Reporting and Analytics
Automating processes
Integration issues
Hiring Issues

Reporting and Analytics
Automating processes
Integration issues
Hiring Issues

Puntos a favor

- Ease of Use - Intuitive both on the admin and end user side
- UI - Contemporary look and feel
- Reporting - Can report on any item in the candidate or requisition fields
- Customization - Can customize product exactly to your liking

Puntos en contra

- No ability to add logic to requisition/offer forms, requisition fields need the ability to auto populate data based on inputs from the user like cost center or department.

Joanna
Joanna
Calificación general
  • Sector: Automoción
  • Tamaño de la empresa: 201-500 empleados
  • Software usado A diario durante Más de dos años
  • Fuente de la reseña

Calificación general

  • Relación calidad-precio
  • Facilidad de uso
  • Asistencia al cliente
  • Probabilidad de recomendación 10.0 /10

Its easy to use and great!

Revisado el 24-10-2017

control over the candidates that come into our system.

control over the candidates that come into our system.

Puntos a favor

Ease of use and accessibility to other job boards, its a great tool and employees think its easy to view all the open reqs and send the positions to referrals.

Puntos en contra

Its more of a manual process, changing templates is a task, setting up interviews for different locations I want to be able to have a button to click for time zones, so I don't have to change it manually in the email to candidates.

Laurie
Calificación general
  • Sector: Gestión de organizaciones sin ánimo de lucro
  • Tamaño de la empresa: Trabajador autónomo
  • Software usado Semanalmente durante Más de un año
  • Fuente de la reseña

Calificación general

  • Relación calidad-precio
  • Facilidad de uso
  • Probabilidad de recomendación 7.0 /10

Decent basic system, gets the job done

Revisado el 10-02-2023

It was a fair system, but not overly user friendly. If you are quite adept at software programs and...

It was a fair system, but not overly user friendly. If you are quite adept at software programs and learning new functions you won't have any problem.

Puntos a favor

Cost effective for first year, then prices increase after that.

Puntos en contra

It takes quite a bit of time to learn the system if you are having others involved - there are a number of steps involved, but once you get the hang of it it works well.

Jason
Jason
Calificación general
  • Sector: Internet
  • Tamaño de la empresa: 201-500 empleados
  • Software usado A diario durante Más de un año
  • Fuente de la reseña

Calificación general

  • Facilidad de uso
  • Probabilidad de recomendación 7.0 /10

Good ATS for most companies

Revisado el 24-01-2019

There are so many ATS options in the market right now, so for an ATS to truly stand out it needs to...

There are so many ATS options in the market right now, so for an ATS to truly stand out it needs to be superb. Jobvite gets the job done, but doesn't have as many features as some of the more well known systems like Greenhouse.

Puntos a favor

Allows Recruiters and Hiring Managers to review, respond, and collaborate on applicants and candidates.

Puntos en contra

A little clunky at times, sometimes it would have lag time.

Regina
Regina
Calificación general
  • Sector: Servicios financieros
  • Tamaño de la empresa: 501-1.000 empleados
  • Fuente de la reseña

Calificación general

  • Relación calidad-precio
  • Facilidad de uso
  • Asistencia al cliente

love this ATS

Revisado el 01-06-2016

I love this ATS! Used HODES, TALEO, and Ultipro before as ATS's at other companies, at JOBVITE...

I love this ATS! Used HODES, TALEO, and Ultipro before as ATS's at other companies, at JOBVITE exceeds all of them! Clean platform! Clean look and feel of the program. Also, love to pull up Jobvite on my phone; easy to use on a mobile!

Puntos a favor

Easy to pickup and learn how to use without any manuals. Their support staff are pretty efficient of taking care of questions and providing solutions quickly. Easy to update job reqs.

Puntos en contra

When you disposition a candidate as hired in one req, would like all the other reqs to close on their own. Not to big of a problem though since the other reqs for the same candidate can be closed manually per req.
Also, wish I could open 1 job req for 1 title, but post in multiple locations, without it looking like I have ten jobs open for that title...

Kevin
Kevin
Calificación general
  • Sector: Tecnología y servicios de la información
  • Tamaño de la empresa: 51-200 empleados
  • Software usado A diario durante 1-5 meses
  • Fuente de la reseña

Calificación general

  • Relación calidad-precio
  • Facilidad de uso
  • Asistencia al cliente
  • Probabilidad de recomendación 4.0 /10

"OK" ATS for short term or growth

Revisado el 08-10-2019

I had a decent experience with them. The software is good for small companies (or individuals), but...

I had a decent experience with them. The software is good for small companies (or individuals), but i'm not sure how they would do with a company over $100mm in revenue. They do have a built in CRM/relationship management, but it was a basic mirror to others you can find out there.

Puntos a favor

Since the people I worked with were remote, having the software cloud-based was definitely a plus. Also, it helps with your onboarding and compliance (though simplistic) which frees up a ton of time.

Puntos en contra

There was a lack of exporting and reporting that you can do. Filling out profiles for potential candidates is great, but importing contacts and having it extrapolate all the information was lacking which, taking time to go through profiles and update them manually.

Respuesta de Employ

Kevin, thank you so much for being a customer! Feel free to reach out to our CS team and they will be able to help you with customizing your reports!

Ryan
Ryan
Calificación general
  • Sector: Software informático
  • Tamaño de la empresa: 1.001-5.000 empleados
  • Software usado A diario durante 1-5 meses
  • Fuente de la reseña

Calificación general

  • Facilidad de uso
  • Asistencia al cliente
  • Probabilidad de recomendación 7.0 /10

Data analysts will enjoy customization, but navigability can be frustrating

Revisado el 01-05-2019

The breadth of data being captured in Jobvite allows me to create robust reports about our hiring...

The breadth of data being captured in Jobvite allows me to create robust reports about our hiring pipeline (diversity, hiring funnel, time from application to hire, etc). Overall the data structure is sensible and usable, once you figure out which columns mean what.

Puntos a favor

Reporting functionality is highly customizable, and the ability to create custom fields is a huge plus.

Puntos en contra

When exporting large datasets to .csv (since it's virtually impossible in Jobvite to export datasets of 50K+ rows to .xlsx), headers for custom fields are labeled in unusable ways (e.g. custom_field_xqqxvfws). It becomes necessary to maintain a separate mapping table and manually vlookup the actual header names before beginning any analysis. It also creates a huge headache when coordinating between data integration specialists who aren't as familiar with the dataset.

Jennie
Jennie
Calificación general
  • Tamaño de la empresa: 51-200 empleados
  • Software usado A diario durante Más de un año
  • Fuente de la reseña

Calificación general

  • Relación calidad-precio
  • Facilidad de uso
  • Asistencia al cliente
  • Probabilidad de recomendación 9.0 /10

Very user friendly! Using this ATS has changed how I recruit and saved us money.

Revisado el 10-11-2017

Streamlined recruiting.

Streamlined recruiting.

Puntos a favor

Ease of navigation. I also like the integration with LinkedIn. Jobvite is also regularly updated and enhanced.

Puntos en contra

When I'm in a candidate record, I can't go back to the req overview. It takes be back to a candidate list.

Stephanie
Stephanie
Calificación general
  • Sector: Edición
  • Tamaño de la empresa: 51-200 empleados
  • Software usado Semanalmente durante Más de un año
  • Fuente de la reseña

Calificación general

  • Relación calidad-precio
  • Facilidad de uso
  • Asistencia al cliente
  • Probabilidad de recomendación 7.0 /10

Easy to use and keeps candidates organized

Revisado el 16-04-2018

Our candidate tracking has improved which has allowed us to keep track of the top quality candidates...

Our candidate tracking has improved which has allowed us to keep track of the top quality candidates. It has also streamlined our internal communications as we can do so within the system and track that as well.

Puntos a favor

I like that jobs and candidates are easy to find in the system. It's easy to attach a disposition to each candidate and keep those of interest in the pipeline so they don't get lost.

Puntos en contra

Reporting and analytical features can use some work. Also, customer support is not easy to get a hold of and while I only had one issue I needed assistance with thus far, it took longer than it should to resolve in my opinion.

Laura
Laura
Calificación general
  • Sector: Edición
  • Tamaño de la empresa: 201-500 empleados
  • Fuente de la reseña

Calificación general

  • Relación calidad-precio
  • Facilidad de uso
  • Asistencia al cliente

Good product, continual improvement but still working on issues

Revisado el 01-06-2016

Jobvite is an easy to use platform for the most part. It's robust, loads quickly, allows for you to...

Jobvite is an easy to use platform for the most part. It's robust, loads quickly, allows for you to move through candidates and requisitions fairly easily and has good reporting that will hopefully grow even more robust. It's a good value for the cost, and is a fairly intuitive system for basic tasks, though higher level admin tasks can feel buried.

Puntos a favor

Fast loading, lots of information, good price point. Great implementation team, lots of training available. Continually improving the process and seem to take customer feedback to heart.

Puntos en contra

Customizable to a degree, building workflows requires back end help that isn't always the fastest. There's no easy way to make on the fly changes to workflows or approvers, which in a far flung organization can be difficult. The offer letter templates have also, in my experience, been pretty finicky.

Benjamin
Calificación general
  • Sector: Aviación y aeroespacial
  • Tamaño de la empresa: 1.001-5.000 empleados
  • Software usado Semanalmente durante 6-12 meses
  • Fuente de la reseña

Calificación general

  • Facilidad de uso
  • Probabilidad de recomendación 7.0 /10

Easy applicant tracking that could use an interface overhaul

Revisado el 21-12-2022

Jobvite is a useful tool that is essential to tracking an applicant and making the process easy for...

Jobvite is a useful tool that is essential to tracking an applicant and making the process easy for everyone. There are a wide range of features for many use cases.

Puntos a favor

I have used the applicant tracking the most. It is easy to create links to send to applicants that links them directly back to you as the one who recommended them. I like how there are a number of ways to share a job posting and it will provide analytics over which postings are the most successful.There are multiple phases an applicant can go through that make it easy to track the status. I am not in HR, so there is a whole side of this that I haven't seen. From a hiring manager stand point, this product definitely gets the job done!

Puntos en contra

The interface can be a bit tricky to get used to. Some controls are in places I wouldn't expect. There are multiple ways to achieve the same thing, but sometimes your ability to do something depends on what method you chose to get there.They recently updated their login technology to be more secure. This is great, but it's a bit clunky. When you time out, the page does not redirect you to the correct login page. I keep having to manually change the url to get to the right place.

Olivia
Calificación general
  • Sector: Software informático
  • Tamaño de la empresa: 1.001-5.000 empleados
  • Software usado A diario durante Más de dos años
  • Fuente de la reseña

Calificación general

  • Relación calidad-precio
  • Facilidad de uso
  • Probabilidad de recomendación 3.0 /10

Just “Ok” if you’ve never used an ATS before

Revisado el 16-11-2022

generally lackluster experience using JV

generally lackluster experience using JV

Puntos a favor

I picked it relatively quickly when I was learning it. There’s not a ton to learn if you don’t go into reporting/analytics so the ramp is easy-ish.

Puntos en contra

Reporting and analytics tools are lacking, candidate/applicant tracking is sub-par.

Usuario verificado
Calificación general
  • Sector: Medios online
  • Tamaño de la empresa: 1.001-5.000 empleados
  • Software usado A diario durante Más de dos años
  • Fuente de la reseña

Calificación general

  • Facilidad de uso
  • Asistencia al cliente
  • Probabilidad de recomendación 9.0 /10

Great ATS that's Constantly Improving

Revisado el 26-11-2020

Overall I have had a good experience with Jobvite and I really like how we are able to post...

Overall I have had a good experience with Jobvite and I really like how we are able to post positions simultaneously to all the best job boards.

Puntos a favor

It's great for applicant tracking as well as automating certain things like candidate scheduling, mass messaging, and resume review. Publisher is also great for automating LinkedIn posts that advertise positions. We recently started using engage which allows us to setup web/email marketing campaigns which is a great feature for targeting niche candidates like people in tech.

Puntos en contra

When I email candidates via Jobvite, all of their messages are attached to the same email which can sometimes be confusing and has caused me to miss emails from them when they all come in at the same time. I also wish that Jobvite had a function where the HR team could approve the offer letter once it has been generated before it gets sent to the candidate.

Usuario verificado
Calificación general
  • Sector: Tecnología y servicios de la información
  • Tamaño de la empresa: 201-500 empleados
  • Software usado A diario durante Más de dos años
  • Fuente de la reseña

Calificación general

  • Relación calidad-precio
  • Facilidad de uso
  • Asistencia al cliente
  • Probabilidad de recomendación 6.0 /10

A good, well-rounded ATS, but not the most modern one

Revisado el 24-04-2019

Puntos a favor

Jobvite is a tool that becomes highly visible in an organisation. All employees, hiring managers and recruiters get one common place to interact.
It's puts a lot of structure in place in a quite easy to use way and you will find yourself relying on the system for feedback and candidate communication. If you don't have a ATS already and if you want to get started with something that becomes a highly used tool for the entire company it's great.
The tool integrates well with LinkedIn Recruiter and other platforms.
It's good at tracking where candidates comes from if your recruiters use the tool correctly.

Puntos en contra

It's CRM functionality is not the greatest and if you want to use Jobvite as a sourcing tool it's not the best.
The reporting tool is not great if you do any customisation to Jobvite. Quite often you find that you just need to export data to excel to find what you are looking for.
Jobvite had some automatization but it's not as good as other ATS.
The pace of development is quite slow. Over the years you only see a few limited functions being added and it leaves you with a feeling that you might need to switch ATS in the longer term. It's not the most modern ATS outthere and if they don't step up their development speed it's will be obsolete in the next few years.

Usuario verificado
Calificación general
  • Sector: Seguridad informática y de redes
  • Tamaño de la empresa: 1.001-5.000 empleados
  • Software usado A diario durante Más de dos años
  • Fuente de la reseña

Calificación general

  • Relación calidad-precio
  • Facilidad de uso
  • Asistencia al cliente
  • Probabilidad de recomendación 7.0 /10

Easy to use but still can get better

Revisado el 03-05-2019

It's very easy to maintain data in the tool and hence our Talent Acquisition Team's work is more...

It's very easy to maintain data in the tool and hence our Talent Acquisition Team's work is more transparent to the stakeholders.

We also get to know where are the delays in the interview process or offer approval process

Puntos a favor

- It's very consumer friendly. If the consumer hasn't used any ATS tool ever, Jobvite has a very easy UI and anyone can pick it up quite quickly without any formal training.

- I really appreciate the quick help I get from the Customer Support team, they are just simply awesome.

Puntos en contra

I would rather write "What could be better" rather than writing any cons

It will be really great if the users can create more and more reports rather than going back and forth with your team, there are many times that there is some amount of data that we require but we can't create the report from scratch and have to keep scrolling through already available reports

Vince
Calificación general
  • Sector: Envases y contenedores
  • Tamaño de la empresa: 501-1.000 empleados
  • Software usado A diario durante Más de dos años
  • Fuente de la reseña

Calificación general

  • Relación calidad-precio
  • Facilidad de uso
  • Asistencia al cliente
  • Probabilidad de recomendación 10.0 /10

Jobvite Review

Revisado el 20-08-2019

The ability to have all candidates in one place and run reporting on the several data points has...

The ability to have all candidates in one place and run reporting on the several data points has been very valuable. The reporting is still a work in progress for our needs.
Since using Jobvite we have been able to provide reliable reporting to our hiring managers and executive team.

Puntos a favor

It serves as a receptacle for all candidates, the ability to communicate with multiple candidates at one time. It's a time saver. The reporting is helpful, the product is easy to navigate. It serves as a one stop product for all things recruiting related from, communicating with hiring managers to candidates and everything in between.

Puntos en contra

The reporting could be stronger, an more fluid approach with LinkedIn Recruiter, and better email options. The ability to add a signature in the email templates that doesn't look generic.

Respuesta de Employ

Vince, thank you so much! We appreciate you!

Usuario verificado
Calificación general
  • Sector: Hospital y atención sanitaria
  • Tamaño de la empresa: 51-200 empleados
  • Software usado Semanalmente durante Más de dos años
  • Fuente de la reseña

Calificación general

  • Relación calidad-precio
  • Facilidad de uso
  • Asistencia al cliente
  • Probabilidad de recomendación 10.0 /10

Best way to manage hiring process!

Revisado el 23-11-2018

We used to have trouble managing job postings across multiple platforms and it was hard for...

We used to have trouble managing job postings across multiple platforms and it was hard for different hiring managers to work with HR to know if they had candidates. Everyone was on a different page or doing their own approach to hiring and we weren't getting the right candidates. Now everyone can log in to one interface for quick and easy updates across every job.

Puntos a favor

I like being able to track candidates throughout the process from where the candidate found us to where in the application stage they are, Jobvite gives so much usable information and makes hiring the right candidate easy! Jobvite easily syncs within our website we are able to have jobs display across our site and easily update them in Jobvite. I can create custom links for social media to track how different jobs are drawing in candidates.

Puntos en contra

My one con is that I cannot customize automated social media postings to employee's profiles by job. It's a great feature to have and would be even better if I could write custom text for each job.

Usuario verificado
Calificación general
  • Sector: Productos farmacéuticos
  • Tamaño de la empresa: 501-1.000 empleados
  • Software usado Semanalmente durante Más de un año
  • Fuente de la reseña

Calificación general

  • Facilidad de uso
  • Probabilidad de recomendación 5.0 /10

Useful, but with a lot of margin for improvements

Revisado el 21-09-2021

It has a lot of potential, but some time should be spent in improving the user interface and the...

It has a lot of potential, but some time should be spent in improving the user interface and the user experience

Puntos a favor

Potentially you can see the whole story of the candidate, starting from they early application ending with the result of the application itself. You have also one single place where to check their resume and skills and provide your own feedback.

Puntos en contra

Its user interface is very chaotic. It could possibly depend on how an user (mine, specifically) has been set up, but it is very hard to navigate on all the steps of the candidature and understanding the overall view of the candidate.
Also for sharing company openings there are so many steps to complete that it is very often confusing what you need to do or not.

Maggie
Calificación general
  • Sector: Transporte/transporte en camión/ferrocarril
  • Tamaño de la empresa: 1.001-5.000 empleados
  • Software usado A diario durante Más de dos años
  • Fuente de la reseña

Calificación general

  • Relación calidad-precio
  • Facilidad de uso
  • Asistencia al cliente
  • Probabilidad de recomendación 8.0 /10

Jobvite rocks

Revisado el 06-08-2019

We get rave reviews from candidates during the onboarding experience.

We get rave reviews from candidates during the onboarding experience.

Puntos a favor

I love that the product is so customizable and integrates nicely with our HRIS systems. I also love that it really helps with branding and creating a wonderful candidate experience.

Puntos en contra

I had issues with turn over of my account manager on the sales side. I also have had to call or use the chat feature a lot and find that a dedicated customer support team per accounts would be the best route to take. instead, I always get differnt peopel with a differnt level of product or account knowledge and I find myself repeating to them.

I'd love to see more premade reports in the system. We live in the world of Data and It needs to be easier to data mine the system

Respuesta de Employ

Maggie, we are so happy to hear that you are loving Jobvite and so are your candidates! I let our Sales Leader and head of Support know your concerns and suggestions.

Usuario verificado
Calificación general
  • Sector: Tecnología y servicios de la información
  • Tamaño de la empresa: 10.000+ empleados
  • Software usado A diario durante Más de dos años
  • Fuente de la reseña

Calificación general

  • Relación calidad-precio
  • Facilidad de uso
  • Asistencia al cliente
  • Probabilidad de recomendación 10.0 /10

None of the Job posting platform is this much simple as Jobvite

Revisado el 16-07-2019

Puntos a favor

I was devastated during my job search, you have to go through 6 different pages and
fill 1000 question answers for no reason, then you race , color, nation, veteran, non veteran,
and may other things that may have the relevancy but in later phase, not in just apply.
And then came,jobvite, easy one page job post application, you can apply in 2 minutes.
I will definitely recommend jobvite

Puntos en contra

Nothing in comparison of other tools in market.

Sharyn
Sharyn
Calificación general
  • Sector: Contabilidad
  • Tamaño de la empresa: 11-50 empleados
  • Software usado A diario durante Más de dos años
  • Fuente de la reseña

Calificación general

  • Relación calidad-precio
  • Facilidad de uso
  • Asistencia al cliente
  • Probabilidad de recomendación 5.0 /10

More of a Rolodex than ATS

Revisado el 28-11-2018

Not great. There are better ATS platforms out there but if you aren't a very large company that...

Not great. There are better ATS platforms out there but if you aren't a very large company that needs a robust system, then this will work.

Puntos a favor

The Pros for this platform are not much...you can easily enough navigate without having to do a tutorial. But that's about it.

Puntos en contra

Reporting is very weak. Customer support is not the easiest and don't try to ask about integrating with another system because we asked for this for about 6 months and got absolutely nowhere.

Kristin
Kristin
Calificación general
  • Sector: Medios online
  • Tamaño de la empresa: 51-200 empleados
  • Software usado A diario durante Más de dos años
  • Fuente de la reseña

Calificación general

  • Relación calidad-precio
  • Facilidad de uso
  • Asistencia al cliente
  • Probabilidad de recomendación 8.0 /10

Jobvite/AMP Review

Revisado el 26-10-2018

Overall, no major issues or complaints about jobvite. It is functional and gets the job done for...

Overall, no major issues or complaints about jobvite. It is functional and gets the job done for the purpose we are using it for.

Puntos a favor

It has the functions necessary to maintain our candidate pipeline

Puntos en contra

It is a little difficult to navigate the site and an old looking UI experience. You also need to reach out to jobvite support to make changes and cannot modify everything on your own.

DeeDee
Calificación general
  • Sector: Ingeniería industrial o mecánica
  • Tamaño de la empresa: 501-1.000 empleados
  • Software usado A diario durante Más de dos años
  • Fuente de la reseña

Calificación general

  • Relación calidad-precio
  • Facilidad de uso
  • Asistencia al cliente
  • Probabilidad de recomendación 7.0 /10

Would be better if they had good Customer Support and their platform was more stable

Revisado el 07-12-2017

It's not horrible, if you've never used an ATS before, you'll think it's terrific. If you've used...

It's not horrible, if you've never used an ATS before, you'll think it's terrific. If you've used some of the others like Level or Greenhouse, you'll think it's fair but not great.

Puntos a favor

I like the ease of use, it's somewhat intuitive and has a lot of good features. They have a lot of good training tutorials online so it's pretty easy to get hiring managers to use it. For the money, it's not a bad ATS, I'd give it a B- if I were grading it.

Puntos en contra

Their site goes down quite a bit which leaves you stuck not being able to do anything.
Customer Support is super hard to get in touch with, you'll stay on the phone waiting for someone to answer for hours, if they ever do they are not very helpful.
The reporting leaves a lot to be desired. It does some very basic reporting, but sometimes the numbers are not accurate and trying to get support to help understand why is impossible.

Usuario verificado
Calificación general
  • Sector: Hardware informático
  • Tamaño de la empresa: 201-500 empleados
  • Software usado A diario durante Más de dos años
  • Fuente de la reseña

Calificación general

  • Relación calidad-precio
  • Facilidad de uso
  • Asistencia al cliente
  • Probabilidad de recomendación 3.0 /10

Jobvite had no way to search its database, it would periodically go down and lacked fuctionali...

Revisado el 09-01-2018

Puntos a favor

Quick to pick up with little training, easy to schedule interviews for candidates and send out template emails with minimal adjustments.

Puntos en contra

Lacked search capability within the database, the system went down often wether it be internal database or the jobs page.

Usuario verificado
Calificación general
  • Sector: Tecnología y servicios de la información
  • Tamaño de la empresa: 201-500 empleados
  • Software usado A diario durante Más de dos años
  • Fuente de la reseña

Calificación general

  • Relación calidad-precio
  • Facilidad de uso
  • Asistencia al cliente
  • Probabilidad de recomendación 3.0 /10

Customer services is terrible

Revisado el 19-10-2018

I will probalby have our team leave jobvite with in 12 months

I will probalby have our team leave jobvite with in 12 months

Puntos a favor

I am able to customize things to track some of the stuff i want but im other platforms that is already an option

Puntos en contra

Customer services is horrendous - I dont even understanmd how it coudl be so bad